What's with the LBGT Community ?

[vittoria]

I dont know if its just me or what, but theres something rotten in the state of our community...

It makes me and my boyfriend quite sad really...

For anyone that doesnt know, he and I are a bi couple. He has his male companions, and I have my female companions. We are quite comfortable in our relationship, and we accept ourselves as part of a community... a group of people sometimes referred to as the LGBT (Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transsexual/Vestite/Gender) community. For some strange reason I have noticed, being Bisexual seems to be looked down upon by the other branches... but we ( as a Bi community) certainly seem to come in handy when it comes time for legislation or parades or any other damn thing that trots our way.

For example, my boyfriend and I went to this bar here in town named "The Grid" (bad advertising is still advertising), and upon entering the doors, we were the recipients of some rather strange looks,( I mean for all they know I couldve been in drag for goodness sake) were treated rather rudely amongst other things, and were insanely overcharged for Coke ($2.50 for a 10 oz. Solo cup with mostly ice). The air of the bar was laden wth ICE --it was the cold shoulder and stiff arm all the way around. This is a bar that is in the National Gay/Lesbian Yellow Pages as LBGT friendly... as in all types of PRIDE... We were victims twice of false advertising...http://http://www.thegrid.com/

Monday and Tuesday nights it was said that there was "free pool" and pool tournaments... sure there were tournaments, but the moment we asked about the "free pool" we were looked at like we were straight. There was advertised "$2 well drinks".

BULLSHIT.

Sunday night was karaoke and free pool. Now that was right, but for some odd reason there was NO $2 vodka drinks. I was charged $4.75 in the basement, and $3.00 on the first floor. One person asked my boyfriend if he had a boyfriend or girlfriend, he replied that I am his girlfriend and that we are a bi couple, THEN asked if I was dating him then why did I have on PRIDE colors... UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMm its possible, as he said in the first place that we are a BI couple... showing some LOVE I mean damn.

I'm seriously thinking about opening my own bar, maybe naming it the "Blue Oyster" (like in Police Academy) or something....and having it be a TRUE LGBT club without the bullshit and nonsense and prejudiced crap.

If there was a certain night that Lesbians are allowed... then say so on the site.(Usage of the word ONLY is usually a first sign....)

If theres a certain night that its Gay or Trans only... then damn say so.

And "Women's Wednesdays " (drag king) nigths dont count... they have a drag queen night and women show up there too!!!

Any suggestions? Thoughts? Theories? I'm just blowing off a bit of steam here, but I'm so tired of getting the shit (hahaha) from the other branches of the community but being buddies and pals when they need "us" for something! I was so pissed yesterday that if I saw another homosexual man I wouldve bitchslapped him---pretty damn salty... and not in a good way

WTF!!!! Not hatin' just contemplatin'...

[FalconAngel]

It's not you.

In more than 20 years of checking places out, I have found very few that are BI friendly.

Most gay bars are either male or female and few, if any, are very friendly to anyone who is openly BI.
It seems that they can handle straight singles being there, but they have problems with couples that are anything but gay/lesbian. With only one exception, I have never had to experience the kind of subtle, but open derision and hostility that you have described.

There used to be the Copa here in Ft. Lauderdale, but they closed down somewhere around the same time as Wilma came through. The Copa was the place for all genders and sexualities to go. There was no hostility for anyone of any sexuality or gender.

Shame that places like the Copa are so few and far between.

[aisuhi]

We are in texas and have had the same feelings at clubs here also. Therefore we havent been to a GLBT club in years. There should be (in our opinion) a bi sexual club(s) for Bisexuals. The cold shoulder turns us off royaly. So we try to meet people in other ways. We feel your pain and this is all we really can say.

C&Y

[vittoria]

Its akin to the phrase " Tell us how you REALLY feel why dont ya".

But what are we to do? Be "Closet Monsters" in our own right? Being openly bisexual is really no different than anything else. I know what I like... and I like both. Its the same as liking two different types of ice cream, chocolate and vanilla... cookies and cream.... peanut butter toffee... with that "Baskin and Robbins 31 flavors" richness that's both smooth AND creamy... YUM !!!

[mn freak]

In any subculture there is always a pecking order, GLBT is no different. We, as bisexuals, are considered second class citizens. In Minnesota, we have one of the largest pride weekends in the country & a large GLBT population. Our pride, only has 1 Bi booth. We (as a couple) don't feel like we are a part of the community. Even under the happy rainbow, bigotry rears it's ugly head.

But, that's just my

[pasco_lol_cpl]

Its akin to the phrase " Tell us how you REALLY feel why dont ya".

But what are we to do? Be "Closet Monsters" in our own right? Being openly bisexual is really no different than anything else. I know what I like... and I like both. Its the same as liking two different types of ice cream, chocolate and vanilla... cookies and cream.... peanut butter toffee... with that "Baskin and Robbins 31 flavors" richness that's both smooth AND creamy... YUM !!!

Sadly I think that is our only option. Damn what I wouldn't give to be able to open a place as well. Every place we have checked on in Tampa has given us the 'cold shoulder' as well. It is demoralizing as all get out.

[HiBiGuy]

Vittoria, I'm sorry to hear about your experience. I live in South Africa and I encounter the very same thing. The amount of misconception about bisexuality and the resulting discrimination towards us is sickening...and infuriating. My own encounters with gay people have mostly ended up with one of two results: Either they run for the hills (because I'm a leper or something) or else there are demands for sex, which when declined, they end up attacking me and accusing me of being afraid of sex...right. Now why don't I just unscrew my penis, put on a platter and hand it to you, why don't I?

When I first realised that I was bisexual, I found a GLBT organisation that offered support groups for non-straight guys. I contacted the mental health manager who promised me the sun, moon and stars. I was given the reasssurance that the counsellor running the one group would contact me. He didn't. I followed up, I was promised that she'd get him to contact me, still nothing. I went to their website and discovered that he's gay so I was left wondering if his feelings towards people like us are the same as most of his community. I've tried following up on numerous occasions but the rest of my emails were simply ignored or at the very least, not replied to.

The only conclusion that I can draw is that they pretend to cater for us in order to receive state funding...most especially since all of their programmes etc cater solely for gay and lesbian folk. My blood still boils when I talk about this experience.

[Toad82]

I wish I could find a place that was more bi-friendly. It seems that every place I go to that is for LGBT people I don't fit in because I say I am bi and not gay. I have had more than one person tell me I am really gay and it is really starting to piss me off. I find it sad that I can't even be apart of a community that I do belong to, without geting shit for sexuality!

RJ

[darkeyes]

I dont know if its just me or what, but theres something rotten in the state of our community...

It makes me and my boyfriend quite sad really...

For anyone that doesnt know, he and I are a bi couple. He has his male companions, and I have my female companions. We are quite comfortable in our relationship, and we accept ourselves as part of a community... a group of people sometimes referred to as the LGBT (Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transsexual/Vestite/Gender) community. For some strange reason I have noticed, being Bisexual seems to be looked down upon by the other branches... but we ( as a Bi community) certainly seem to come in handy when it comes time for legislation or parades or any other damn thing that trots our way.

For example, my boyfriend and I went to this bar here in town named "The Grid" (bad advertising is still advertising), and upon entering the doors, we were the recipients of some rather strange looks,( I mean for all they know I couldve been in drag for goodness sake) were treated rather rudely amongst other things, and were insanely overcharged for Coke ($2.50 for a 10 oz. Solo cup with mostly ice). The air of the bar was laden wth ICE --it was the cold shoulder and stiff arm all the way around. This is a bar that is in the National Gay/Lesbian Yellow Pages as LBGT friendly... as in all types of PRIDE... We were victims twice of false advertising...http://http://www.thegrid.com/

Monday and Tuesday nights it was said that there was "free pool" and pool tournaments... sure there were tournaments, but the moment we asked about the "free pool" we were looked at like we were straight. There was advertised "$2 well drinks".

BULLSHIT.

Sunday night was karaoke and free pool. Now that was right, but for some odd reason there was NO $2 vodka drinks. I was charged $4.75 in the basement, and $3.00 on the first floor. One person asked my boyfriend if he had a boyfriend or girlfriend, he replied that I am his girlfriend and that we are a bi couple, THEN asked if I was dating him then why did I have on PRIDE colors... UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMm its possible, as he said in the first place that we are a BI couple... showing some LOVE I mean damn.

I'm seriously thinking about opening my own bar, maybe naming it the "Blue Oyster" (like in Police Academy) or something....and having it be a TRUE LGBT club without the bullshit and nonsense and prejudiced crap.

If there was a certain night that Lesbians are allowed... then say so on the site.(Usage of the word ONLY is usually a first sign....)

If theres a certain night that its Gay or Trans only... then damn say so.

And "Women's Wednesdays " (drag king) nigths dont count... they have a drag queen night and women show up there too!!!

Any suggestions? Thoughts? Theories? I'm just blowing off a bit of steam here, but I'm so tired of getting the shit (hahaha) from the other branches of the community but being buddies and pals when they need "us" for something! I was so pissed yesterday that if I saw another homosexual man I wouldve bitchslapped him---pretty damn salty... and not in a good way

WTF!!!! Not hatin' just contemplatin'...

Dus all this mean now me cum out as a lessie ya don luff me ne more V???

But wotya says is rite babes... the LGBT community is a bloody mess.. an 2 b honest cudn run the proverbial piss up in a brewery.. seems werere ya goes they dus everythin 2 fragment an not 2 much 2 unite an reely go 2 town on beina community... Sure is triff wen it cums 2 pride..but break it down 2 more mundane an local then ya has the fragmentation of socialisation yas talkin bout an loadsa arseholes lookin down ther nose atya cos ya turned up on rong nite.. aint 2 bad on bigga picture..the national scene an all or the world LGBT scene..but at the local level?? Mostly it all a wasta time.

Not so long bak word had gotten round 2 me gay m8s that me now accepted mesel as a lessie an stopped callin mesel bisexual.... cuppla the arseholes turned up at me door cos suddenly ther wos this whole new world opened up 2 me... Gaydom Inc .."new" social scene previously denied me... an 1a the silly arseholes sed 2 me now that me don accept the existence of bisexuality how dus it feel 2 hav lived a lie all this time... jeez e jus bout gorris bollox rammed down is throat... wos a statement that always did get me hackles up an now me accepts mesel as gay that don change... Fuk..Naggy a bisexual gal for Gods sake...silly sod jus didn put is brain in gear at all... jus cos me a lessie don change me views on bisexuality...

An finally V me yummie luffly..wenya opens up this den of iniquity an alcoholic tranquility..me assume me gets an invite... will sit onya knee an b nice 2 ya ..honest...

[CuddlyKate]

Not so long bak word had gotten round 2 me gay m8s that me now accepted mesel as a lessie an stopped callin mesel bisexual.... cuppla the arseholes turned up at me door cos suddenly ther wos this whole new world opened up 2 me... Gaydom Inc .."new" social scene previously denied me... an 1a the silly arseholes sed 2 me now that me don accept the existence of bisexuality how dus it feel 2 hav lived a lie all this time... jeez e jus bout gorris bollox rammed down is throat... wos a statement that always did get me hackles up an now me accepts mesel as gay that don change... Fuk..Naggy a bisexual gal for Gods sake...silly sod jus didn put is brain in gear at all... jus cos me a lessie don change me views on bisexuality...

You dont half exaggerate at times when you tell a story, Frances dear. I do think however, having your bright red face and wild eyes about half an inch from his and screaming at the top of your voice was quite sufficient to make your point and frighten most people into submission.

[DiamondDog]

Bar drinks can be expensive, even for soda.

I've been to all types of bars that charge anywhere from $1.50-$3.00 for a soda that's mostly ice, and some bars don't give you free tap water but make you pay for bottled water.

Make sure you go at a time when drinks are on special like happy hour, and also remember that if you go for middle shelf or top shelf expensive liquor they're going to charge you more for your drink.

Sometimes certain drinks aren't on special and other ones are. Ask the bartenders what the drink specials are when you go to the bar.

Also make friends with the bartenders and get to know them. They're not just there to serve you drinks. I've even gotten free/greatly reduced price drinks, learned how to make new drinks, and made great friends in the process of all this. Bar staff want you to go into their bar to buy drinks and hopefully leave them tips.

Also in most bars, especially gay ones if bar staff doesn't like you, you're fucked.

I've never had a problem with all types of people who I've met in gay bars/clubs and all types of bars, and people have accepted me as myself.

Gay/Bi/Lesbian/Trans people don't always get along that well.

There are lots of gay men who don't like seeing transwomen and bio women, even lesbians at gay bars/clubs, and there are lesbians who don't like seeing transmen, trans women, or bio men at dyke bars/clubs and [sic] womyn's music festivals.

Trans feel slighted and left out because of the anti-hate crime bill that does not include them.

Bisexuals need to become more militant/agressive and should become more visible and create their own bars/clubs/discussion groups.

There IS no really valid "gay culture" or GLBT culture, any more than a straight one.

[darkeyes]

You dont half exaggerate at times when you tell a story, Frances dear. I do think however, having your bright red face and wild eyes about half an inch from his and screaming at the top of your voice was quite sufficient to make your point and frighten most people into submission.

Don always work wiv u tho dus it babes....

[MarieDelta]

I dont know if its just me or what, but theres something rotten in the state of our community...

It makes me and my boyfriend quite sad really...

For anyone that doesnt know, he and I are a bi couple. He has his male companions, and I have my female companions. We are quite comfortable in our relationship, and we accept ourselves as part of a community... a group of people sometimes referred to as the LGBT (Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transsexual/Vestite/Gender) community. For some strange reason I have noticed, being Bisexual seems to be looked down upon by the other branches... but we ( as a Bi community) certainly seem to come in handy when it comes time for legislation or parades or any other damn thing that trots our way.

For example, my boyfriend and I went to this bar here in town named "The Grid" (bad advertising is still advertising), and upon entering the doors, we were the recipients of some rather strange looks,( I mean for all they know I couldve been in drag for goodness sake) were treated rather rudely amongst other things, and were insanely overcharged for Coke ($2.50 for a 10 oz. Solo cup with mostly ice). The air of the bar was laden wth ICE --it was the cold shoulder and stiff arm all the way around. This is a bar that is in the National Gay/Lesbian Yellow Pages as LBGT friendly... as in all types of PRIDE... We were victims twice of false advertising...http://http://www.thegrid.com/

Monday and Tuesday nights it was said that there was "free pool" and pool tournaments... sure there were tournaments, but the moment we asked about the "free pool" we were looked at like we were straight. There was advertised "$2 well drinks".

BULLSHIT.

Sunday night was karaoke and free pool. Now that was right, but for some odd reason there was NO $2 vodka drinks. I was charged $4.75 in the basement, and $3.00 on the first floor. One person asked my boyfriend if he had a boyfriend or girlfriend, he replied that I am his girlfriend and that we are a bi couple, THEN asked if I was dating him then why did I have on PRIDE colors... UMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMm its possible, as he said in the first place that we are a BI couple... showing some LOVE I mean damn.

I'm seriously thinking about opening my own bar, maybe naming it the "Blue Oyster" (like in Police Academy) or something....and having it be a TRUE LGBT club without the bullshit and nonsense and prejudiced crap.

If there was a certain night that Lesbians are allowed... then say so on the site.(Usage of the word ONLY is usually a first sign....)

If theres a certain night that its Gay or Trans only... then damn say so.

And "Women's Wednesdays " (drag king) nigths dont count... they have a drag queen night and women show up there too!!!

Any suggestions? Thoughts? Theories? I'm just blowing off a bit of steam here, but I'm so tired of getting the shit (hahaha) from the other branches of the community but being buddies and pals when they need "us" for something! I was so pissed yesterday that if I saw another homosexual man I wouldve bitchslapped him---pretty damn salty... and not in a good way

WTF!!!! Not hatin' just contemplatin'...

I very often hear the same thing from my trans friends, about the LG(bt) community. Seems like the lesbians and gays want very little to do with the last two letters of the acronym, save when it comes time to do some tail kicking.

Not all lesbians and gays are that way , of course, but there are a certain amount of them that are very vocal about it.

Now I know that LGBT were all there when stonewall heated up, and truth be told we all have common interests.(HIV education/ prevention/ cure and equal rights etc...)

But how do you make someone realize that you aren't "invading their space, raping them with your 'male' energy" or that you aren't 'betraying' them by being bisexual? Or that you aren't out just enjoying the community when you feel like it and then going back to your het job and lifestyle when its not convienent to be lgbtq.


I don't know & these are only a few of the frustrations I have with our "community".

Note: The T in Lgbt stands for Transgender - transvestites and transexuals are two variants of transgender. Like butch and femme are two variant type of lesbians.

[softfruit]

In Minnesota, we have one of the largest pride weekends in the country & a large GLBT population. Our pride, only has 1 Bi booth. We (as a couple) don't feel like we are a part of the community. Even under the happy rainbow, bigotry rears it's ugly head.

There's only one bi stall at Pride here in Manchester, too. There's the stuff and the demand to justify two stalls... but not the volunteers and the money to run them. Collectively we only have ourselves to blame: if more of us showed up at LGbt Pride and made more noise, more fuss, put more time into the activism and the visibility... then they couldn't damn well ignore us so easily.

[diB4u]

That is just really not right, but I can understand it somewhat... Not that all the Sraight or the Gay community think that a Bisexual or a Bicurious person is testing the water... some people do though.

What I am having difficulty in doing is actuarly offline meeting either bisexual gay or lesbian friends. There is one local site that has off line activities but that does seem to be aimed at either Gay men or Lesbian women.

Its funny how I can see that being Bisexual can seem to some people as the 3rd sexuality. The umbrella of GLBT does include bisexuals.

I think what DiamondDog said is true Bisexual celebrities and normal folk do need to be more militant... However I see straight, gay and bisexual people as individual and for me it doesnt really matter..

I am glad that I am pansexual, because I'm attracted to many forms- to gay men (yes I am a woman), bisexual men, gay butch women, bisexual 'soft' women, transexuals, transvestites (pretty looking ones thought!) I also like drag queens and drag kings...

I guess that finding like minded people is hard enough...

[ChsnyNLelandsBsh]

I dont get accepted in the straight community or gay community.....there are a very few that do accept me....

[jamiehue]

Ride on.

[Gemini25]

It is VERY unfortunate that the GLBT "Community" we are all a part of, that is supposed to be a group of people supporting and accepting one another, is so seperate. I'm the type of person that I like everyone. I don't care what your sexual preferance is, I don't care what color you are, or your religion. If you are cool, and nice I will talk to you and be your friend. I have had several experiences where there is a GLBT event, and the lesbian community doesn't participate, they would rather creat their own womens only groups. I have learned that the generation people grew up in has a lot to do with the way they associate with the rest of the community. I have a lesbian friend who for years until she met my ex and I never associated with guys at all. After she got to know us, she was actually kind of embarressed that she was so closed minded. I have several Transgender friends who say they are discriminated against more then us BI's. But when we go to events they are more excepted, and welcomed then I am. I understand for a lot of people Bisexuality is something new to them, and they don't understand it. The pride event here in Sacramento California, doesn't even have a BI booth, and I don't even know where to start to get information to have one. My ex and I are looking into opening an all inclusive bar/restaurant/club with a sign on the front door that says "This is a BI and Gay owned and operated establishment, everyone is welcome, if you can't handle it Go Somewhere Else". And it would, in different ways, support the different aspects of the GLBT community. It's still a long way off, but we are all about supporting the GLBT community no matter who you are. I agree with what was said before that Bisexuals need to become more of a presence. We shouldn't be affraid, and I know it's also a very hard thing to do. So baby steps my friends, to the exceptance and understanding from our fellow members of the GLBT community
P.S. About the drink price changes each time a drink was ordered why didn't you mention something about their advertised specials? I ask what the specials are all the time no matter what kind of bar I go into. You just never know where you will get a good deal, or what's on special may be better then what you actually wanted in the first place.
Sorry this was so long winded, and hope I didn't offend anyone.

[howardtracie]

I have been to Cleveland several times and often visit the Grid. It is probably one of the best nightclubs I have ever visited. I have to say that for someone who was not treated nicely, you sure went there on many different nights! I have never had a bad trip to Cleveland/Grid.

[wanderingrichard]

The Copa was the place for all genders and sexualities to go. There was no hostility for anyone of any sexuality or gender.

Shame that places like the Copa are so few and far between.

add Mad Myrna's to that list of ALL ARE WELCOME.. it's in downtown Anchorage, AK. small little place, but so friendly and open and always jumpin...2 blocks or so over.. the raven something or other.. totally gay, total meat market..totally intolerant of everyone else... most Myrna's patrons will warn ya way from it if they get a chance..

[FalconAngel]

Well, like we said, the Copa has long since closed. There is another club just a block or 2 away that has since reopened called The Coliseum.

Don't really know a whole lot about the Coliseum. Even the website is light on data, so not really sure about the place.

[CSBForum]

Bisexuals need to become more militant/agressive and should become more visible and create their own bars/clubs/discussion groups.

Collectively we only have ourselves to blame: if more of us showed up at LGbt Pride and made more noise, more fuss, put more time into the activism and the visibility... then they couldn't damn well ignore us so easily.

Amen to that! Here in Colorado Springs we don't have a bi booth at the Pride Fest. But we will next year. Why? Because i'm gonna do it.

[vittoria]

I have been to Cleveland several times and often visit the Grid. It is probably one of the best nightclubs I have ever visited. I have to say that for someone who was not treated nicely, you sure went there on many different nights! I have never had a bad trip to Cleveland/Grid.

Two times is a bit less than "many different".

To clarify..

Sunday..karaoke, free pool, 2.25 vodka drinks...
yes yes no

My boyfriend and I went the next day... as advertised on their site ( in the link provided in my thread above, take note, Monday) It's advertised $2.00 well drinks, and free pool. Which NEITHER were what was going on... and its not a matter of whether or not they check their site for flaws... they update it every week for different events, so its not like they dont know what's on their site. The question is whether or not my BF and I were treated differently because we are a Bi COUPLE--in the bar as a bi male dating a bi female open--not whether or not the bar is cool. The bar can be a cool place if you're in there exclusively as just a lesbian, or DEFINITELY as a Homosexual male. And certainly every bar either community owned or straight owned can have their fair share of assholes. However, giving an establishment a chance ( the theory "maybe we showed up on an off night"), and returning the following day after checking their link for events that evening, then being treated like crap was uncalled for. On their link http://www.thegrid.com, it doesnt say that certain nights are male only or female only. "Women's Wednesdays" are mainly for drag king shows, and there are males that show up from what I have heard. There have ALWAYS in my experience been women that show up to drag queen shows. But theres no defining "ONLY" in each advertisement for each different night, and its pretty bad when in the National Gay/Lesbian Yellow Pages its listed LGBT friendly, and their attitude clearly states the contrary, at least to the "B" in the phrase... bisexual.

Besides, my boyfriend and I have the perfect solution, we'll just go to Akron if we want to go to a LGBT ( in the true sense of the word) club. The Innerbelt, Adams Street, Club Amsterdam, and even Lydia's have NEVER ONCE given us grief Besides, I personally think theres more of a bi community there as well... it IS my hometown after all.

[DiamondDog]

Vitt-It's not the other people doing this (making you feel uncomfortable in what you view as a purely homosexual environment or a queer environment), it's all in your head and you and your BF 31Cho are the ones doing it to yourself.

Your own fears, anxiety, discomfort, and homophobia coming out of hiding when you're in a non-heterosexual environment and forced to communicate with people face to face who aren't heterosexual and you're not online with them.

FWIW, not all homosexual men and women even enjoy going to gay/GBLT bars/clubs/spaces and many find them downright boring and homogeneous. I've certainly found some of them to be this way and I don't need to go to bars to meet people.

I've been to gay/GLBT events but I go to meet people, dance with hot men, play pool, and have fun and that's usually what happens.

Also, nowadays there are TONS of heterosexual men and women who go to gay/GLBT bars for fun, or who work at gay/GLBT bars/clubs gay/GLBT owned businesses (i.e. restaurants/pubs/etc.)

[_Joe_]

Well, in the effort to have a place of their own they obviously see you as part of the enemy still. a Two-timer!

[Bi_Druid]

I know the feeling of being somewhat 'singled out', but I 'spose I've been fortunate as such discrmination isn't (or at least doesn't appear to be) so bad here in Brighton at least. Saying that I tend not to frequent the scene much anyway, jiust isn't really my thing. But the few LGBT friendly places I do go to don't seem to care what you are, you're moneys as god as anyone elses, so long as you're a decent person.
This is the main reason why I only frequent such places. The Brighton Tavern I've personally found most friendly.

I do sometimes enjoy exercising my presence and right to be on the scene at times, going out with my female friends and male friends and making an overt point to be Bi, mostly just becouse I'm having fun, but to make the biggotted few realise that we are here, and we arn't going to hide or be pushed around.

the idea of a Bi themed venue is appealing. May even help bring our community together more so, especially those of us who feel pushed out or put upon by over venues. Together we are strong.

[bidarthvador]

Vitt-It's not the other people doing this (making you feel uncomfortable in what you view as a purely homosexual environment or a queer environment), it's all in your head and you and your BF 31Cho are the ones doing it to yourself.

Your own fears, anxiety, discomfort, and homophobia coming out of hiding when you're in a non-heterosexual environment and forced to communicate with people face to face who aren't heterosexual and you're not online with them.

FWIW, not all homosexual men and women even enjoy going to gay/GBLT bars/clubs/spaces and many find them downright boring and homogeneous. I've certainly found some of them to be this way and I don't need to go to bars to meet people.

I've been to gay/GLBT events but I go to meet people, dance with hot men, play pool, and have fun and that's usually what happens.

Also, nowadays there are TONS of heterosexual men and women who go to gay/GLBT bars for fun, or who work at gay/GLBT bars/clubs gay/GLBT owned businesses (i.e. restaurants/pubs/etc.)

diamondog this is your father speaking come out of the closet my son.Be one with glbt.Be not afraid.

[PhysicalFriend33]

Yes I know what you mean. It seems that gay bi or lesbian we are all expected to live up to some media generated image of what a buch of shallow self centered people think we should be and I also wanted to echo my agreement about THe LGBT community only wanting bisexuals whenever there is some parade or event...Its exploitation for a cause. I at one time in my life identified as gay but as time went on I found I was bi instead and found the Gay pride celebrations were not totally welcoming in a lot of ways because I got the impression that if you werent totally gay and easily politically manipulated you were useless in daily life.Oh wait this is an election year again so you know all the freaky deekys have "come out" of the woodwork to push their causes and want to include us bisexuals as a way of creating diversity when in reality its just to increase numbers and make the illusion of a united front on issues. Another reason I dont do the Pride celebrations especially during election years is because I dont like being preached at and told how to vote(I hate this so you are commanded to vote no on it too kinda shit).

If I owned a bar I most certainly would make damn sure everyone was welcomed with open arms and treated like family and not expect certain behaviors for social acceptance. Come as you are ! And I certainly would not rip off my guests with high price drinks.The myth in Gay Land is since you are gay or Les you must be really rich and can afford to party like a rock star. Ha ha ! I am appalled the mainstream world only sees LGBT as a bunch of party whores when in reality we live our lives Gay/Bi as quiet citizens making it month to month in this titanic of an economy.

If only People could see bisexuals as the decent people we are and treat us with dignity we deserve.

[DiamondDog]

diamondog this is your father speaking come out of the closet my son.Be one with glbt.Be not afraid.

I've been out for years, and I've stayed out, unlike Vitt&Cho31.

You both should take your own advice that you love to dish out but don't want to take and ignore, since your own homophobia, fears, anxiety, and prejudices against other people who happen to be homosexual are coming out in you when you're in gay bars/queer environments.

We all know how much Vitt doesn't like butch lesbians!

I don't subscribe to diehard GLBT politics as scattered and unorganized as they are, the idea of a real gay/GLBT "community" or a real gay/GLBT "culture" since there are no such things just like there's not a heterosexual "community" or a heterosexual "culture".

What gets confused as being a real gay/GLBT "community" or a gay/GLBT "culture" is really just mass consumerism and like PhysicalFriend33 wrote it's a media image.

Anyway I'm not the only one who has noticed this over the years as PhysicalFriend33 wrote about and other friends of mine have told me.

[Bi Boi Indiana]

The wife and I have found the exact same thing at a place in St. Louis Missiouri Called " The Complex " For the most part everyone was "NICE" But well when i turned around and Kissed my wife ....... Lord you would have thought i dropped a damn bomb or something .... you should have seen the guys, a few of them acted as if they were going to Vomit ... it was rather insulting to Both of us .... I mean I FOR One Stand up and Support the Gay Community ALOT .... And then to have one of them Slap me like that in the face ..... Well i dunno! I havent stopped my support ... but i do remember that night every time i go out and do something that supports the gay community ....

They want there equal right's, So when do they support us Bi's ? ..... And stop calling us fence riders, OR Cunfused .. Honey that's ONE THING IM NOT!
And that's CONFUSED .....

God dont even get me started, i could go on for hours and hours ...

Great topic tho darling ... thanks for bringing this up for discussion

~HUGZ~
BILL