We're Always Being Insulted

[naughty'BI'chick]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

[darkeyes]

Not all str8 peeps r so judgemental an downrite rude hun.. not all r holy jo types who take outa scripture wot they wan jus 2 match up wiv ther spite an hypocrisy.. neitha for that matta r all gay an lesbian peeps tho sum in 'ere an in the bisexual world seem 2 think so.. hav nev been str8 eva since me cud memba.. mosta me adult life hav always thotta mesel as bisexual an called mesel jus that.. an sure hav had me moments wen sum prejudiced arsehole or bigotted cow hav tried 2 preach ther mumbo jumbo 2 me.. an me gob has shot off an hav usually, tho not always had em runnin for cova.. hav been beaten cosa me sexuality, an thats sadly a risk peeps who r considered not "of the norm" run wen they r open bout themsels.. but not all.. in fact me wud say most let us liv our lives an get on wiv wot we r..

Ther exists a huge minority a str8s who think we r pervs an that the law shud return 2 that wich existed until bout haff a century 'go. If we don stik up for oursels an keep on strivin for true equality undastandin an acceptance an our human rites the day may cum wen they will gerrit an all.. but thats up 2 us... the bisexual an gay an lesbian community.. an jus think on this.. no matta how much we r discriminated gainst by the str8 community, how much bi peeps r in addition by elements wivvin the gay an lesbian community (for that exists an all.. tho not as badly or as much as sum bi's seem 2 claim).. the trans community get it much nastier.. an much worse than u as a bi person or me as a lesbian will eva get.. jus talk 2 summa the trans peeps on site or read suma the posts in forums... the gr8 thing bout humanity is it diversity in all things... an that includes sexuality an gender.. an we shud glory in that an allow peeps simply 2 liv ther lives in peace an persuade the bigotted 2 do likewise an c that they hav little 2 fear from gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgendered peeps... we r all human an we shud b treated wiv compassion an humanity no matta our sexuality..

[tarzanthejungle]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

Yes, which is one reason I am not "out" to anyone except a very few trusted and respectful friends. It is also why I no longer date straights, no matter how attractive they seem. I feel that only another bisexual person will ever truly understand my attractions, and even some of the bisexual women I've dated were so caught up in drama that it impacted our relationship. The good news is that all of the judgment of the self-righteous means nothing to us, and if they aren't careful it will come back on them. In the meantime, I just keep my distance from the judgmental crowd - there are a lot of accepting people in the world, who are willing to value us "different" people for our contributions and for our existence. Let's celebrate them, even if they aren't bi like us.

[transcendMental]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

I hate when LGB people look down on me just because I'm trans. They say it's silly, wrong, and all kinds of other shit. I've heard people say there really isn't any such thing as transsexualism, that it's all in my head. It gets really old when people say that.

I read in another thread on this very site:


At least you don't identify as being male when you do not have a penis!

I think it's rather silly when butch lesbians and Trans 'men' identify as male when neither of them are male at all.


Now this applies directly to FtM transsexuals, rather than to MtFs like myself, but I assume the poster feels the same about MtFs and claiming to be a woman. And you know what? Not a single bisexual on the site even challenged this person's transphobic remarks. You can say "This is a bi site, not a trans site. Go complain somewhere that applies to you." But if LGB people are not willing to stick up for transpeople when they see them being ignorantly slighted, they don't really have grounds to complain that straight people are ignorant and rude to them.

So to the original question, yes I've had that kind of thing happen to me, both from straight people and from LGB people, both about being trans and about being bisexual. It never feels very good. So it would be a start if we'd agree not to do this to each other.

[FalconAngel]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

You can always respond in kind to those idiots. Tell them the same thing that they tell you.


I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

If it is right wing Christians that say it, then we know that they are following a hateful and evil God that lies to them all the time.


Otherwise, which God are they talking about, because none of the Gods that we believe in care about what our sexuality is. Matter of fact Gay and Bi folks are considered to be blessed by the gods in many ancient and Pagan cultures because they carry the energies of both male and female; the divine union of male and female.

[Long Duck Dong]

transcendmetal...... its a sad fact of life, that not everybody is gonna jump to everybodies defence......

as for gayazn.... they are outspoken...and not everybody wants to fight with others on the site, or *defend * everybody else.....
there comes a point where we just wanna sit down and talk, not fight battles....

bi the way.... I mean by the way, this is a community site, not just a bi site.... there is no way in hell I and many others, will tell people they are not welcome cos they do not *fit the criteria * for the site....

expression of opinion is what defines us, if we remove that right for others, then we have no right to express ourselves.... and gayazn was expressing a personal viewpoint about labels and how people use them, but others do not support the same viewpoint....thats hardly transphobic as they were addressing butch lesbians as well

now everybody can support us, agree with us, side with us..... but do we really want people to...... if everybody was all touchy, feelly, then things like trans pride, gay pride, bi pride etc, lose a lot of its meaning....

we are proud to be who we are in the face of opposition and proud to not be *going away any time soon *
but we state that we have the right to be heard and to express ourselves..... we can not demand that right, if we want others silenced for opinions we do not beleive in or support

[MarieDelta]

I hate when LGB people look down on me just because I'm trans. They say it's silly, wrong, and all kinds of other shit. I've heard people say there really isn't any such thing as transsexualism, that it's all in my head. It gets really old when people say that.

I read in another thread on this very site:



Now this applies directly to FtM transsexuals, rather than to MtFs like myself, but I assume the poster feels the same about MtFs and claiming to be a woman. And you know what? Not a single bisexual on the site even challenged this person's transphobic remarks. You can say "This is a bi site, not a trans site. Go complain somewhere that applies to you." But if LGB people are not willing to stick up for transpeople when they see them being ignorantly slighted, they don't really have grounds to complain that straight people are ignorant and rude to them.

So to the original question, yes I've had that kind of thing happen to me, both from straight people and from LGB people, both about being trans and about being bisexual. It never feels very good. So it would be a start if we'd agree not to do this to each other.

You know back when i first came to this site I asked if trans people were accepted here.

The responses I got were lukewarm at best.

Somehow I think people seem to think of us as an oddity , something outside the norm. Well so are we all. We are all unique and if we cant stand up for each other then the whole movement falls apart.

Remember, it was trans* who started stonewall. we are the crazy few who push the envelope forward, why? Because we have nothing left to lose.

We are the fringe, Bi people tend to get lost in the mix, trans-people stand out like a sore thumb and yet we are both disdained by the L&G contingents. Further Bi people tend to see trans* as some sort of kink and it isn't.

Better to hang together than to hang separately. I will not stand by while someone denigrates a gay man, or a lesbian woman, or somebody who is bi. Because that *is* me, in a certain sense. I can be seen as all of those , depending on who is seeing me.

[morethan.worldover]

When I was a freshman in high school I was really open with my bisexuality but there was a group of girls in my art class who always made fun of me and called my friends and I (many of whom were also bisexual, or gay) disgusting and that bisexuals were all slutty..

Since then I've been really discreet, I've never been one to "broadcast" my orientation but if someone asks or if the topic arises I will tell it like it is. Still, it really hurt me back then and when I think about it now it still hurts, a lot. If I think about it too much sometimes I come to tears. At times I wish I never liked girls.. I despise people who are so closed-minded like that, they never gave anyone a chance.. I wish there were more understanding people in the world. I think it's such a shame though that even at my age there are still bigots, but I suppose it can't be helped.. :(

There was an instance where one of my older friends (who is a lesbian) was walking into a coffee shop or something like that, and it so happened that one of her old acquaintances worked there. So they exchange greetings a few words and the girl who worked at the shop noticed that my friend was trying to put a rainbow keychain on her phone. She said, "Why do you have a rainbow keychain?" My friend replied, "Well, because I'm gay." Her acquaintance's demeanor changed immediately, and she said, "I'm sorry, but you can't be here." My friend, who is usually so out-spoken, was speechless. All she could say was, "So that's how it's gonna be?" And the worker said, "Yeah, it is." And my friend was kicked out of the establishment.

And.. yeah.. done talking now..

[MarieDelta]

.

expression of opinion is what defines us, if we remove that right for others, then we have no right to express ourselves.... and gayazn was expressing a personal viewpoint about labels and how people use them, but others do not support the same viewpoint....thats hardly transphobic as they were addressing butch lesbians as well



It is transphobic - butch lesbians and flaming gay men are both trans* by definiton

PS: Transgender is a general term applied to a variety of individuals, behaviors, and groups involving tendencies to diverge from the normative gender roles. Butch Lesbians and flaming gay men fit that definition.

[transcendMental]

thats hardly transphobic as they were addressing butch lesbians as well


So if someone says "gays and blacks make me sick", that's not homophobic, because they're addressing blacks as well? That's ludicrous.

I don't demand someone jump to my defense. But to hear someone say "the group I belong to is always being insulted" when the group I belong to was just insulted by her group happened to rub me the wrong way, and I felt the need to speak out, k?

If people want to stop fighting and sit down and talk, I welcome that. But there doesn't seem to be much appetite here for discussing trans issues, even as they impact the bisexual community.

Defend it as "just an opinion" all you like, but saying that transpeople's gender identifications are "rather silly" is not a matter of simple disagreement or political correctness or not being "touchy feely". It's belittling and hurtful. And ignorant. And transphobic.

tm

[Long Duck Dong]

then call me biphobic cos I say that 99% of bisexuality is nothing more than getting laid by both genders but fluffed out to look like its something totally different......

never mind the fact I am bisexual....

I was making the point that it is getting to the point where a opinion can not be expressed without some people being called phobic.....

but what is phobic
A phobia (from the Greek: φόβος, phóbos, fear or morbid fear), is an intense and persistent fear of certain situations, activities, things, or people. The main symptom of this disorder is the excessive and unreasonable desire to avoid the feared subject. When the fear is beyond one's control, and if the fear is interfering with daily life, then a diagnosis under one of the anxiety disorders can be made.

we are sitting here insulting the hell out of people over opinions that are personal opinions and lumping them in the same class of people that spout hate and discrimination speech.....

this is the reason why a lot of people have STOPPED posting on the forum.... the irrational and over the top reactions to remarks....the trolling.... hell even I stopped talking about trans people cos of reactions by trans people to issues surrounding trans people,...... innocent and accidental statements that were not offensive not intended to be offensive, were jumped on and the poster torn apart

the issue is not one of phobia.... but people being too dammed sensitive and failing to see that not everybody is * flaming, slamming, trolling or looking to start shit *... many of us wanna just talk, converse, share and enjoy the community spirit...... but thats become impossible .......

instead people are getting hammered for not being supporting, understanding, open minded etc.... you only have to look at the cheating threads issue where the bisexual community were hammered for NOT supporting people that were cheating and lieing to partners.....
that tells you right there, how it have become impossible to say anything without somebody taking offense to it .........

now I may be wrong, I may be right..... I do not know.... all I know is many people that used to post in the site....no longer do..... I wonder why ?

[_Joe_]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

If they are a Christian you can always throw a few things back in their face. First - remind them that is it NOT their place to judge you. Second, they should follow their own scripture and hate the sin, not the sinner.

[rissababynta]

All I have to say is that if it's not one thing, it's another. People find out something about you and they decide that if they don't like it, sometimes they'll come right out and be a jerk off about it. Doesn't matter what exactly it is, it can be anything.

[_Joe_]

Ya rissa, you get on my nerves because one of your armpits is bigger than the other. WTF GIRL, GTFO OF MY INTERNETS.

[MarieDelta]

Actually butch lesbians and flaming swishy gay men, and even drag kings and drag queens are not trans at all.

While they may be rather stereotypical of how a heterosexual society thinks that mostly all lesbians and gay men act or dress up/behave during sex (I seriously get REALLY tired of heterosexuals asking me "So with you and your husband....which one is the man and which one is the woman in the relationship and when you have sex???) their gender is fixed, and even if they do dress up as the opposite gender that just means they are imitating that gender and do not wish to actually attempt to try to change the biological sex or gender that they were born and always will be, and they identify as the sex and gender that they were born.

It's not like flaming gay men or drag queens will tell you, "Weeeeeeeeeel dear I'm not REALLY a man you see, I'm trans! YAY!!!!!"

Please see the definition of transgender, and how it relates.

Their identity may not be that of a transsexual, however they are still transgender per the definition. They have characteristics that one does not typically associate with their gender, that makes them, in fact , trans.

A crossdresser may be 100% heterosexual male, however they are still transgender as is a transvestite , and yes, a drag queen (or king.) Aside from which it is the perception on the part of this person that makes it trans-phobia (yes, perception does play a part.)

Once again the defintion of transgender (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender): a general term applied to a variety of individuals, behaviors, and groups involving tendencies to diverge from the normative gender roles.

[rissababynta]

Ya rissa, you get on my nerves because one of your armpits is bigger than the other. WTF GIRL, GTFO OF MY INTERNETS.

Well you piss me off because you draw faces on your balls, now get off of my website! :tongue:

[_Joe_]

Well you piss me off because you draw faces on your balls, now get off of my website! :tongue:

You just don't know how to appreciate fine art.

[rissababynta]

You just don't know how to appreciate fine art.

Oh Joe, it was the finest of the finest. I think it was the nurse who didn't appreciate it if I remember correctly lmao.

[morethan.worldover]

Your lesbian friend really did not have to legally leave or allow herself to get kicked out of the coffeeshop at all when she was told she somehow could not be there by the person working there based on what you wrote about.

I could see if she was getting ready to close the store and the person working there said, "Sorry but we're getting ready to close and you have to leave..."

Did she talk to the manager or if that person was a manager complain to the people who are higher up?

I have been out since I was a teenager in the 80s and I have talked about my sexuality to straight people working at stores, or been there with men who I was dating or in a relationship with at the time, and I have never once been told that I have to leave a store, bar/restaurant, or coffeeshop just because I am a gay man.

Even the flaming queens who everyone knows are gay do not get asked to leave or refused service just because of their sexual preference.

What was the name of this coffeeshop? Was it a chain? Were there other people in the store who saw this happen?

I think my friend only left because of the shock and suddenness of it all. She didn't talk about it with too much depth. I agree, the worker had no right to do what she did, but I'd leave too if that happened to me, I wouldn't want to be in the same place as a person like that working there either. Also, I don't know what the name of the coffee shop was. I want to say it was Seattle but I can't be sure.

[naughty'BI'chick]

Not all str8 peeps r so judgemental an downrite rude hun.. not all r holy jo types who take outa scripture wot they wan jus 2 match up wiv ther spite an hypocrisy.. neitha for that matta r all gay an lesbian peeps tho sum in 'ere an in the bisexual world seem 2 think so.. hav nev been str8 eva since me cud memba.. mosta me adult life hav always thotta mesel as bisexual an called mesel jus that.. an sure hav had me moments wen sum prejudiced arsehole or bigotted cow hav tried 2 preach ther mumbo jumbo 2 me.. an me gob has shot off an hav usually, tho not always had em runnin for cova.. hav been beaten cosa me sexuality, an thats sadly a risk peeps who r considered not "of the norm" run wen they r open bout themsels.. but not all.. in fact me wud say most let us liv our lives an get on wiv wot we r..

Ther exists a huge minority a str8s who think we r pervs an that the law shud return 2 that wich existed until bout haff a century 'go. If we don stik up for oursels an keep on strivin for true equality undastandin an acceptance an our human rites the day may cum wen they will gerrit an all.. but thats up 2 us... the bisexual an gay an lesbian community.. an jus think on this.. no matta how much we r discriminated gainst by the str8 community, how much bi peeps r in addition by elements wivvin the gay an lesbian community (for that exists an all.. tho not as badly or as much as sum bi's seem 2 claim).. the trans community get it much nastier.. an much worse than u as a bi person or me as a lesbian will eva get.. jus talk 2 summa the trans peeps on site or read suma the posts in forums... the gr8 thing bout humanity is it diversity in all things... an that includes sexuality an gender.. an we shud glory in that an allow peeps simply 2 liv ther lives in peace an persuade the bigotted 2 do likewise an c that they hav little 2 fear from gay, lesbian, bisexual or transgendered peeps... we r all human an we shud b treated wiv compassion an humanity no matta our sexuality..

I didn't say all, I said some. I have some straight friends who don't mind and some that thinks it's kinda cool

[Long Duck Dong]

Please see the definition of transgender, and how it relates.

Their identity may not be that of a transsexual, however they are still transgender per the definition. They have characteristics that one does not typically associate with their gender, that makes them, in fact , trans.

A crossdresser may be 100% heterosexual male, however they are still transgender as is a transvestite , and yes, a drag queen (or king.) Aside from which it is the perception on the part of this person that makes it trans-phobia (yes, perception does play a part.)

Once again the defintion of transgender (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender): a general term applied to a variety of individuals, behaviors, and groups involving tendencies to diverge from the normative gender roles.

again it comes down to labels.......and the labels used by people

I know of few people that ID as trans people, but do drag / gender impersonation roles..... they ID as either male or female, the gender they were born as

but using the defination loosely, any female that wears male clothing, can be labeled a trans person.... IE the wearing of pants that was traditionally a male aspect of identification....

back to the defination tho.... the term trans gender as applied in the wiki site, labels people that do not ID themselves as trans...... and once again, when applied to others, gives them a ID that they may not desire or wish to be associated with......

hence you can label butch lesbians as trans, when in fact they merely have a strong masculine personality trait....and when you label them by a label they do not wish to use, they react adversely....... leading to the anti LGBT sentiment that we can see in the LGBT community......

once again it comes right back to forced labels and accusations of closeting.... something that can be far from the truth......
what is actually happening, is that the person is being told to use a label that others feel they should use....... a label that can ignore any number of aspects in a persons life.....and if used, can lead to any number of problems

take a butch lesbian, a feminine gay, a crossdresser ( including females that wear males clothing and a trans gender people that is transitioning or has transitioned and a male that enjoys the feeling of wearing female underpants......and you can use the term trans people to define them all.....

this would immediately lead to confusion about the terminology of trans gender / trans person.... and have the trans people up in arms about the mis labelling of trans person and the misunderstanding of what being trans is all about

wait a moment..... do the trans people already not scream the roof down about the usage of the terms * she male * ( correctly used by people that ID as she male and I do know a few, not the porn movie label ) and wanting to seperate the trans people from that aspect of trans gender people......
would that not be a case of trans phobia by the trans people

and do not insult me by challenging *she males * right to use the label they choose to use, when the definition of trans is being used to label people that do not ID or associate themselves as trans people

I do have a dear friend that is not fully transitioned and nor do they intent to, they ID themselves as * she male *, and their partner is intersex ( have dual genitalia ) the shemale aspect refers to the fact they are female in appearance and can have sex as a male or as a female ( they view anal sex as a option for males and female so ID their role as a bottom as being female )

by defination they are both trans people, neither of them ID as trans people, the trans community will shit bricks over the use of the term * she male *, when in fact its a persons right to use the label they choose, to be define themselves, not others to decide what label they use.....but the trans community will also claim them as trans by defination......

so if a butch lesbian or feminine gay chooses not to be labelled as a trans person, any words against them that are labeled as trans phobic are incorrect, as the trans label is being applied by others, not the lesbian or gay, themselves.......

[transcendMental]

I did see your definition.

These people that I described do not want to personally call themselves trans or transgendered and that's their choice and they are not trans for the reasons I listed.

Why should they be forced to call themselves trans when they are not trans at all?

If a man or a woman dresses up as the opposite gender for fun like for Halloween, a costume party, or for a play does this somehow make them trans then?

This is just as bad as in another thread I replied to where an ignorant man said how if a gay man, or lesbian has sex with the opposite gender because they are closeted how this somehow makes them bisexual, or he wrote about how it's impossible for a person that is gay or lesbian to know or realize that they are gay or lesbian since they have not had a heterosexual experience. :rolleyes:

Never once in all my years of hanging out around gay men who do happen to be flaming queens, drag queens/kings, or butch dykes have I heard any of them identify as being Trans or saying how they are trans first and somehow not a gay man or a lesbian woman.

I think HornedUpRam and Marie are getting hung up on the distinction between a definition and a label.

A label is something a person can choose to apply to themself or not. A definition either does or does not apply to a person, thing, or concept.

By Marie's definition (which is the standard definition of transgendered), a butch lesbian is transgendered, whether she likes it or not. She may not identify as trans, or apply the trans label to herself, that is her choice. But she fits the definition and therefore is transgendered according to that definition.

I do not identify as transsexual or transgendered. I identify as a woman - that's what makes me transsexual, by definition. I do not like that this definition applies to me, but it does. I can't deny that. So I avoid the trans label wherever I can - but the definition I am stuck with.

So it matters if we're talking about whether or not a definition is satisfied, or if we're talking about whether or not a person identifies with a certain label. Those two things are very different. I think Marie and HornedUpRam are not getting each other, because Marie is claiming something about definitions, but HornedUpRam is claiming something about self-labeling.

btw, the man who cross-dresses for Halloween only is not trans, because cross-dressing at Halloween is not outside the gender norm for our culture, so that man doesn't fit the definition.

[Long Duck Dong]

definations are dangerous cos we use them without knowing the person.... so we define by the label....

define me
I am a 39 year old scottish male

I am intersex ( without female organs ) in that I have a hairless chest, back arms and legs naturally, and I do suffer PMS cramps and a form of menstruation cycle in that my body follows a 28 day cycle ( I do not have periods )

I am bi gender, this refers to the strong male and female personality traits that were diagnosised by a clinical psychologist, simply I manifest a male and a female personality depending on environment and social stimuli
I also follow common female traits such as cooking, cleaning, care giving etc but I have don manual labour

I am bi sexual, but I can correctly ID as pansexual as I am not confined to male / female gender attraction, I am also attracted to intersex / trans and asexual people....

I am predominately celibate, I lack the sexual / reproduction drive that is common in males

I am comfortable in all forms of clothing, kimonos, boxers, sarongs, feminine underpants, skirts, kilts etc etc


I am bisexual, I can top and bottom, I can be the male or the female role in sexual encounters.... but its equally balanced, I do not have a predominate sexual indentity

but defination, I only fit the trans defination on a few levels, on others I fit the cultural identity of the scottish ( kilts ) and pacific islands ( sarongs )

so the differculty is defining me..... as I have no absolute points for defination....

to call me trans is to say that all kilt wearing people are trans..... or that all pacific island people that wear sarongs are trans, or that all people that wear ladies panties are trans..... but that would be false and wildly incorrect...
it is akin to say that rice eating people are asian by defination........

that is the thing with definations..... they have no defining boundaries, they make unproven assumptions about people..... and ignore all other possible aspects

transcend as you say, by defination you are trans gender / trans sexual... but you have points that allow people to apply the defination correctly to you.... even tho you are a lady, a female
the defination is based around the actions or steps you took to get to that point....

I never did anything like that...I was born as me, I am me, so any definations that are based around me are based around me as I was born.... I have taken no steps to be me..... so I am trans and I am no trans.... by defination......

[MarieDelta]

If a man is killed because (http://transgriot.blogspot.com/2008/08/willie-houston-story.html) he is holding his wife's purse and assisting a blind person, he isn't being killed for being a good Samaritan...

If a woman is housed in a male prison (http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/strange/news-article.aspx?storyid=87351), it isnt because she was lesbian.

If a woman is thrown out of a female bathroom (http://current.com/items/88969541_woman-mistaken-for-a-man-settles-ny-lawsuit.htm), is isnt because she was going in the wrong bathroom.

These are all examples of transphobia, directed at non trans people.

so... who says you have to be trans to feel the brunt of transphobia?

[roy m cox]

try being a furry and BI oh god the lie's people say about us "damnit"

just ignore them is the best thing to do :)

remember they are real life trolls and have nothing better to do than say that their shit don't stink :eek:

[Long Duck Dong]

roy I need a favour.... please...... furries is a term I have heard about and mentioned...and I am interested in learning more about the lifestyle....

can you please start a thread with a few links if possible so that I can learn more about the furry lifestyle from a bisexuals point of view as you are rather unique .....

[morethan.worldover]

So did she leave on her own, or was she asked to leave and kicked out since she is lesbian?

I'm pretty sure it was a voluntary leave, cus I'm almost positive she wouldn't get kicked out for her orientation. My story must have sounded like she was kicked out but that wasn't what I meant. Sorry if there was any misunderstanding.

[jamiehue]

I hate when some people, who are straight, look down on me just because I'm bisexual.
They say it's gross, wrong and all kinds of other shit. It gets really old when people say that.

I've been told that I'm disgusting and going against God. I was told once that God was going to punish me and that I was gonna get my ass kicked for being bisexual

Has anyone ever have someone insult or give you speeches about how it's wrong?

Hey nbc although i try with words there are some folks on this site that are quite understanding and provide insight to many bi issues they are usually right on the mark in giving support and advice and put a lot of thought and concern in their replies. jamie.

[MarieDelta]

Trans-Ponder Episode 145 – Not your average Joe

In Episode 145 (http://www.trans-ponder.com/episodes/episode145.mp3) – (right click and save as to download here) Did we mention that you all helped us get nominated for a podcast award? Well now we need your help with daily votes on Podcastawards.com. Twitter it, Facebook it, tell your friends and family. We need everyone’s help if we are going to represent the T in the LGBT.

We invite an outside perspective in a conversation from Joe Mannetti, International Daddy Bear 2009. How does the Gay community view trans people, and how is Joe working to make the LGB a more welcoming place for the T. We talk about the disappearance of diversity, and why we need to celebrate difference.

We Endorse Joe Mannetti as Bear of the year, for his tireless work bringing the T and the GLB closer together. Please show your support as well at http://completebear.com/index.php/best-of-the-bears-2009

Really interesting conversation about bringing our communities together.
http://www.trans-ponder.com/episodes/episode145.mp3

[Doggie_Wood]

You know back when i first came to this site I asked if trans people were accepted here.

The responses I got were lukewarm at best.

Somehow I think people seem to think of us as an oddity , something outside the norm. Well so are we all.
Bi people tend to see trans* as some sort of kink and it isn't.

I see Love :love:

Doggie :doggie:

[onewhocares]

I see Love :love:

Doggie :doggie:

I see love too! I hope for acceptance, understanding, compassion, integrity from those fine folks here.

Belle

[bimeornot]

They are idiot. But seldom str8 insult me. Most of them are nice. I'm bi and I'm proud to be what I'm.

[Doggiestyle]

You know I wasn't going to make a post to this thread, but I will, I just don't know why!
Yep, I been called a "fuckin faggot" too (amongst other names also). :yikes2: In my town I like to get all un-dressed up in skimpy (but legal) shorts and a pink t-shirt, and go out in the public, during the summer. I guess that being dressed like that is asking for derogatory comments, HUH!!! Actually I kinda like it, strange as it may sound. :confused:
Anyway I can remember I was at the Atlanta Pride one year and this street preacher was going off on their usual preachin bullshit and as I was waiting to cross the street and he started into me telling me all about all the sin I was living in, and how I was going to hell, and going to spend all my eternity in a lake of fire cookin like a side of beef over a bar-b-que pit, and so on he went... Well,,, I gave him one of them "Clint Eastwood smiles" :smilies15 and said WOW you are not only convinced that i am going to hell, but you seem to act like you are glad of it!!! And he started saying naw man it like this, and off onto another condeming adventure he went. I started laughing and asked him "just what makes you so fuckin mean anyway, and the way you are condemning everybody and everything??? I guess that your mom & dad must have beat you up and hid you in a closet when you were a kid and now you are taking out your revenge out on the world, HUH?.......He shut up and did not have much to say to me after that. I musta have hit a nerve that time.

So, for the hidden message in this adventure of mine is this. So I got called a bunch of names,,,,,so what about it????? I'me not any richer or poor-er, tall-er or shorter, pretty-er or uglier, smarter or dumber, I mean that nothing about me has changed, I am still the same person. I am satisfied, and secure in knowing who, what, when, and where I am in this world. Their words cannot touch, hurt, or change anything about me. So, I get over it!

Now I have to admit that it is not a pleasant thing having somebody, or a group of somebodies calling you names, making accusations, and so on. All the while the general public watching and saying something like, dammmmmm what brought this on? What I am ultimately getting at is that their words are not going to change you, so how can they hurt you?!?! If they are getting to you and "ratteling your cage" then, maybe, you may have some personal issues that you need to deal with!!! Or maybe you need to learn to control yourself!!! :mad:

Now if they get to the "laying of hands" on you.......Now that's a different story alltogether..........Something that would take some training to overcome.......But even that's possible..........Just takes some time, that's all

Your friend, :doggie:

[Long Duck Dong]

Or you can argue that being GLB has everything to do with someone's sexuality and nothing to do with their gender which is what being Trans has everything to do with.

I've met trans people who do not see a point to even being grouped with GLB people since someone's gender and their sexuality are not related and they are two separate groups with different needs.

I'm all for Trans people getting their own rights on their own, but leave the association or idea that you simply must be included with GLB people at the door.

The rights of GLB people and trans people are not connected, not related, and GLB people have separate issues and rights that do not include those of Trans people who regard us as being 'cisgender' and having rights that are so-- in most trans people's opinon 'wrong' just because we have a gender that does not change at all.



if I read this right..... you are saying that trans as a gender aspect should not be part of the sexuality aspect GLB ????

that it should be GLB as sexuality based.....

but if we use only sexuality then we need to include the A for alternative sexuality or any sexuality not covered by the GLB tag....and there is a huge list that is Alternative sexuality

[Long Duck Dong]

A lot of times people who have 'alternative' sexualities are not even queer or are not even GLB/gay, lesbian, or bisexual so they should not be included with us GLB/queer people just because they may not have vanilla sex yet are heterosexual.

For people who are into kink or BDSM they have their own groups and there are even kink and BDSM groups for queer cisgender men only!

There's a well known men's only BDSM event in America that is for Cisgender men only, and Transmen are not allowed to attend this private event at all.

I see nothing wrong with this as it is a private event and they can make up the rules how they see fit for who they want to let in and who they do not and they only want Cisgender bisexual, gay, and queer men there.

I was not refering to kink or BDSM, they are sexual desires, not attractions

I was refering to alternative sexuality.... things like intersex / asexual / autosexual..... and yes they are valid sexualities.... and often overlooked or never acknowledged

[TwylaTwobits]

A lot of times people who have 'alternative' sexualities are not even queer or are not even GLB/gay, lesbian, or bisexual so they should not be included with us GLB/queer people just because they may not have vanilla sex yet are heterosexual.

Sorry but as a heterosexual who doesn't have vanilla sex I take offense to that. I have been welcomed here as the straight person I am and I have learned a lot about bisexuality and how my partner has dealt with and deals with his lifestyle. Well at least I used to feel welcome.

[MarieDelta]

Or you can argue that being GLB has everything to do with someone's sexuality and nothing to do with their gender which is what being Trans has everything to do with.

I've met trans people who do not see a point to even being grouped with GLB people since someone's gender and their sexuality are not related and they are two separate groups with different needs.

I'm all for Trans people getting their own rights on their own, but leave the association or idea that you simply must be included with GLB people at the door.

The rights of GLB people and trans people are not connected, not related, and GLB people have separate issues and rights that do not include those of Trans people who regard us as being 'cisgender' and having rights that are so-- in most trans people's opinon 'wrong' just because we have a gender that does not change at all.

Yes you can argue that a drag queen was at stonewall and that she is somehow Trans but most drag queens do not identify as being trans and are gay men first and foremost. They just imitate women by dressing up as them but do not identify as trans or female or anything but a gay man.

Her name was Sylvia Rivera, she did transition, as did many of the other drag queens.


Gender is not a social construct. Just because I say that I'm something other than male, identify as or wish that I am the other gender that does not make it true. I'm not trans but I'm a cisgender Kinsey 6 gay male which most Trans people hate and love to blame all of their own personal problems on people like me who are Cisgender or our natural born gender. Gender isnt a social construct. Gender is between the ears, physically. Sex is between the legs, and yes I have done the research on this, have you?


Or even if I hypothetically had all of the surgery, hormones pumped into me, and everything else that trans people get it still would not make me change my gender completely at all.

Trans people can take all the hormones, get all the surgery they want to mutilate or cosmetically surgically alter their perfectly fine genitals into fake penises or vaginas that do not even work, and take all of the gender studies classes and therapy they want but they still will not be real men or women.

Still after all that it is VERY easy to tell if a person is a trans'man' or a
trans'woman' since they look so fake and not natural at all.

Trans-'men' will never become men since they have vaginas--this is a fact. They will always be a third sex Other.

Bravo for India. Recognizing that there are three sexes: cis men, cis women, and Other (trans of all kinds plus genderqueers who choose their sex and gender at will).

Perhaps we can stop the farce of the "pregnant man" over here and realize that when someone has XX chromomsomes and is biologically a woman it is not hard for her to give birth. Or maybe she can stop being such a media whore like she was with Oprah and People magazine? :rolleyes:

Then there are those Trans'men' who think that they are being radical because they constantly whine about how Cisgender gay men like myself are being 'trans phobic' because most Cisgender gay Men do not want Trans'men' as sex partners, to hook up with, or for relationship partners at all since they are a woman who is cosmetically altered to try yet greatly fails to be a man, and we want other cisgender gay and bisexual men who are biologically men and not women who have attempted yet failed on multiple levels to be men. Trans'men' will always have a vagina, and even if they do get surgery it will never change their vagina into a real penis that actually works like a cisgender man's cock does. Even cisgender men who are born with penile defects or who have had their cocks amputated are more biologically real men than any trans'man' with a cunt is or ever will be.

Also what they consider to be 'masculine' is a farce and everyone can easily tell that they are not really male at all and they foolishly do not realize that gay cisgender men like myself do not want transmen as partners even for hook ups and certainly not for relationships since we only want other Cisgender bisexual and gay men, and not women who have lots of surgery and take hormones who will always have vaginas and will always be biological women no matter how many hormones they take like candy or how they try to over compensate for having Penis envy! ;) Sorry ladies, you can try to imitate us cisgender men all you want but you will NEVER be us! :bigrin:

Well that certainly outlined your position.

Let me explain where I am coming from for a minute.

I've never claimed to be anything other than a transsexual female, I know that my past will always be a masculine past. I wont lie to people or pretend other wise. I don't care if you have a problem with me, if you don't want to sleep with me, it doesn't matter to me. I wouldn't think that the Trans men who you don't want to sleep with think they are missing out either. You obviously have lost no love for them.

When trans / bi / lesbian/ gay people are attacked( how often does that happen where you are?) It is because they are not meeting the stereotypes that are set out for men and women. Its pretty much that simple.

Besides when (most) straight people see me , they often assume(incorrectly) I am a gay man. To most of the straight people of the world you and I look exactly the same.

Oh and by the way, I don't hate gay men, why would I? I don't have a lot in common with them, but I certainly do not hate them.

The rights you have that I want, well I wouldn't take them away from you, I just think EVERYONE should be equal. That's all, is that so hard to swallow? Is it such a stretch? Because honestly, if things were equal for men and women, everyone would be free from those expectations. Not just me and those like me.

[Doggie_Wood]

Now you all know why I love this girl sooooo much.:smirlove2
Intelligent, forcefull yet subtle. :impleased
And she's as good in the kitchen as she is in bed. :kiss:

Doggie :doggie:

[rissababynta]

Sorry but as a heterosexual who doesn't have vanilla sex I take offense to that. I have been welcomed here as the straight person I am and I have learned a lot about bisexuality and how my partner has dealt with and deals with his lifestyle. Well at least I used to feel welcome.

Sorry to hear that you are feeling unwelcome now, but don't let yourself feel that way because of THAT guy...sheesh...

[rissababynta]

Or you can argue that being GLB has everything to do with someone's sexuality and nothing to do with their gender which is what being Trans has everything to do with.

I've met trans people who do not see a point to even being grouped with GLB people since someone's gender and their sexuality are not related and they are two separate groups with different needs.

I'm all for Trans people getting their own rights on their own, but leave the association or idea that you simply must be included with GLB people at the door.

The rights of GLB people and trans people are not connected, not related, and GLB people have separate issues and rights that do not include those of Trans people who regard us as being 'cisgender' and having rights that are so-- in most trans people's opinon 'wrong' just because we have a gender that does not change at all.

Yes you can argue that a drag queen was at stonewall and that she is somehow Trans but most drag queens do not identify as being trans and are gay men first and foremost. They just imitate women by dressing up as them but do not identify as trans or female or anything but a gay man.

Gender is not a social construct. Just because I say that I'm something other than male, identify as or wish that I am the other gender that does not make it true. I'm not trans but I'm a cisgender Kinsey 6 gay male which most Trans people hate and love to blame all of their own personal problems on people like me who are Cisgender or our natural born gender.

Or even if I hypothetically had all of the surgery, hormones pumped into me, and everything else that trans people get it still would not make me change my gender completely at all.

Trans people can take all the hormones, get all the surgery they want to mutilate or cosmetically surgically alter their perfectly fine genitals into fake penises or vaginas that do not even work, and take all of the gender studies classes and therapy they want but they still will not be real men or women.

Still after all that it is VERY easy to tell if a person is a trans'man' or a
trans'woman' since they look so fake and not natural at all.

Trans-'men' will never become men since they have vaginas--this is a fact. They will always be a third sex Other.

Bravo for India. Recognizing that there are three sexes: cis men, cis women, and Other (trans of all kinds plus genderqueers who choose their sex and gender at will).

Perhaps we can stop the farce of the "pregnant man" over here and realize that when someone has XX chromomsomes and is biologically a woman it is not hard for her to give birth. Or maybe she can stop being such a media whore like she was with Oprah and People magazine? :rolleyes:

Then there are those Trans'men' who think that they are being radical because they constantly whine about how Cisgender gay men like myself are being 'trans phobic' because most Cisgender gay Men do not want Trans'men' as sex partners, to hook up with, or for relationship partners at all since they are a woman who is cosmetically altered to try yet greatly fails to be a man, and we want other cisgender gay and bisexual men who are biologically men and not women who have attempted yet failed on multiple levels to be men. Trans'men' will always have a vagina, and even if they do get surgery it will never change their vagina into a real penis that actually works like a cisgender man's cock does. Even cisgender men who are born with penile defects or who have had their cocks amputated are more biologically real men than any trans'man' with a cunt is or ever will be.

Also what they consider to be 'masculine' is a farce and everyone can easily tell that they are not really male at all and they foolishly do not realize that gay cisgender men like myself do not want transmen as partners even for hook ups and certainly not for relationships since we only want other Cisgender bisexual and gay men, and not women who have lots of surgery and take hormones who will always have vaginas and will always be biological women no matter how many hormones they take like candy or how they try to over compensate for having Penis envy! ;) Sorry ladies, you can try to imitate us cisgender men all you want but you will NEVER be us! :bigrin:

This whole post was either wrong or completely offensive. Congratulations, you've hit an all time low.

[TwylaTwobits]

Sorry to hear that you are feeling unwelcome now, but don't let yourself feel that way because of THAT guy...sheesh...

It's okay Rissa it's not the first time I have encountered misogynistic and opinionated assholes. That's a statement not directed at a gay man(it has nothing to do with sexuality surprise surprise but of morals) but a man with no common sense and a superiority complex so inflated he could fly his own zeppelin. Ignore works just fine.